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Thread: the idea that socialism goes against 'human nature'

  1. #51
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah View Post
    It's called "socioeconomic" for a reason, God. Social stigma, the people you surround yourself generally reflect the person you become. Ignorant parents teach their children poorly or not at all about important stuff, those kids don't take it upon themselves to learn, and end up being poor when they're older. The information to get ahead is just an internet connection, a library trip, or a phone call away and they just don't do it. The not lazy poor people who resist that stigma however can easily develop a plan for pulling ahead of the crowd.

    Granted part of this falls on the shoulders of a broken education system, but even as is the information on how to get a degree in a rather affordable way, how to get a better job, how to manage finances, how to invest, and many other things is right in front of our faces.
    doesnt this kind of prove my point
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  2. #52
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    Not knowing and not looking are two different things. I'm poor and I don't know how to become rich, but I know there are ways and I've started looking, and already I have a pretty good idea on what I want to do. I certainly don't want the government taking a higher percentage of my paycheck and forcing me to live until the ever increasing retirement age in a lifestyle that is equivalent to $50k-$70k combined household income.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  3. #53
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah View Post
    Not knowing and not looking are two different things. I'm poor and I don't know how to become rich, but I know there are ways and I've started looking, and already I have a pretty good idea on what I want to do. I certainly don't want the government taking a higher percentage of my paycheck and forcing me to live until the ever increasing retirement age in a lifestyle that is equivalent to $50k-$70k combined household income.
    well what do you think makes people not want to research into these things. are people who dont just born lazy? if so then why do more middle class people take initiative in researching these things than in the lower class? you either have to accept that people born of higher classes are chosen by god or something to be vassals of greatness or something while poor people are just born genetically lazy or you have to accept that capitalism has inherent bias towards people from birth based on socioeconomic status, and thus 'personal responsibility' is mostly bullshit.

    even though you are poor you certainly cant compare yourself to say an inner-city black. there are a few things that have worked in your favor, out of your control, that puts you in a better position. for one you're white, and also for whatever reason you got into the 'internet culture' which has encouraged you to do research on such matters, im sure you being homeschooled has a lot to do with this. so yes where anyone is/goes in life really has 99% to do with circumstances mostly out of their control.

    i wouldnt have any problem with the government taking (a lot)more of my money if i knew it were going to worthwhile things, like healthcare, efficient criminal rehabilitation, real and meaningful social welfare(not the revolving door type we have now), and well-funded foreign aid programs.
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  4. #54
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    "What really matter is the 1% you change."

  5. #55
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    just on time solly interjects with a mind-bogglingly irrelevant post
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  6. #56
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    Well Timmy, think about it. Most of that 99% that can't be changed are things like when you need to take a crap and when you sleep. That little 1% is your social status. You effect 75% of your social life.

  7. #57
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    Middle class parents teach their children to be middle class, lower class parents teach their kids to be lower class, etc. But the kids have a brain, and all it takes is for them to have a little foresight and planning.

    Personally I would not want my wages garnished to pay for the parasites. What did they do to deserve my money? What did I do to deserve it be taken away? If I were to be successful I'd be punished by having the fruits of my labor given to people who the government deems "disadvantaged" thus giving them an even bigger inferiority complex and a constant reliance on the welfare system which is nothing but a death spiral for the economy.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  8. #58
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah View Post
    ]But the kids have a brain, and all it takes is for them to have a little foresight and planning.
    if this were true(in a working context) then wouldnt there be a lot more economic mobility. wouldnt we see a lot more intelligent underclass rising above their circumstances, and wouldnt wee see a lot more stupid upper class losing their status due to fucking up(which basically never happens).

    i've gone on record that i like him as a president better than most other presidents, but someone like george w bush is a prime example of why capitalism doesnt work. the type of system which allows people to call for the underclass to have more personal responsibility is the same system which allows the upper class to abdicate responsibility because the wealth of their family(which they had nothing to do with) will always bail them out. and since these are the people running the country, i would rather the focus on personal responsibility be geared toward the upperclass than the lower.
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  9. #59
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    I have two examples from my little nitche of the world at work:

    My manager, Mr. Walker, was born a poor black kid. He grew up constantly wanting to learn how to do stuff and made a living in various professions. With good planning, he now works as my assistant manager and has a second job to sustain himself. But he also owns a strip club, all the profits of which go towards his other investment ventures, including real estate and tow trucks to start a car scrapping company.

    My coworker Jeff's parents are rich because his mom, though born a poor black, went to college and became an accountant. She now makes well over six figures and enabled the family to move from a very racist part of NC to a wealthy part of Virginia.

    Secondly, being wealthy does give you a kind of safety net for screw ups in life, both yours and your family's. If they use it too much however they will eventually run out of net.

    It seems our argument is just a disagreement, not a right and wrong. You seem to think it's the duty of the rich to be responsible and help the poor, I seem to think it's the duty of the poor to be responsible and help themselves. It all comes down to how you define things like justice, fair, etc.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  10. #60
    Nidogod That Ho!!! Nidogod's Avatar
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    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  12. #62
    Pokemon Champion Mario The Black Knight's Avatar
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    Hmm?

  13. #63
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    Eerrrr.....

    Nazism vs. Socialism?

  14. #64
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    There are actually parallels to draw between Nazi Germany and how Capitalism generally works. The domestic majority's living standards increase dramatically, at the expense of a foreign/domestic minority.

    Plus i would probably say Nazi Germany > The British Empire.
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  15. #65
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    However Nazism's fault was that the leader had absolute control.

  16. #66
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    um i think there were a lot of things at fault with nazism
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

  17. #67
    Nidogod That Ho!!! Nidogod's Avatar
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    Pretty much. The people in that photo are actually friends of mine. I just felt like making a motivational poster out of it.


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    Registered Users Regular TeenageAngst's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    yes look at all these intelligent answers. i cant handle it.
    lulz
    "I prefer a sane world where you are rewarded by providing people with something they want. Not arbitrarily rewarded in a status game that reminds me of chimpanzees." - nazgulnarsil

    Here I am with my empire
    Iíll bring you to your knees
    Ebb and flow with my desire
    Cause its all that youíve been taught to be

  19. #69
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Nidogod View Post
    Pretty much. The people in that photo are actually friends of mine. I just felt like making a motivational poster out of it.
    You're a friend with neo-Nazis?

  20. #70
    Father Figure Qoorl's Avatar
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    Sol... it was a joke! (They're pagans)
    JOIN AN RP YOU SLACKERS!

  21. #71
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    We really need a sarcasm smiley.

  22. #72
    In a world... where a voice from the heavens tells you to CUT LOOSE. Octazooka's Avatar
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    Or text. I wonder what they would look like? I try using Italic to stress parts of the sentence that need stressing, but....
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  23. #73
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    [/Sarcasm]

  24. #74
    In a world... where a voice from the heavens tells you to CUT LOOSE. Octazooka's Avatar
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    Yes, but what would the lettering look like?
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  25. #75
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    oh my god can the solly, shadow, octazooka and yojimbo express stop posting in every fucking thread
    "I'll go," said Chagataev. "But what will I do there? Build socialism?"
    "What else?" said the secretary.

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