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Thread: British Politics

  1. #26
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    You're correct about that, but you're incorrect in the claim that utilitarianism is a better option than developing your own moral compass.

  2. #27
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    I didn't say better, I said as good as. But if I had said better, developing your own moral compass requires some form of baseline, and once again utilitarianism is as good a base as any, so why not just jump straight to it in the first place?

  3. #28
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    Well then you're still wrong. This all ties back in to the conversation about the nature of the human mind in the other thread, there are more inputs than empirical evidence, without giving all information consideration you're operating under a skewed and inaccurate perception of things.

  4. #29
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    What does this have to do with evidence?

  5. #30
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    Worldviews are formed based on your interpretation of the many aspects of life. Determining what is valid information and what is not is simply a part of the subject.

  6. #31
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    And what does that have with utilitarianism? Look, morality has to be based on something, right? In most cases this is a set of absolute majority agreed baseline values, which means that morality is based on utilitarianism already: it's what the majority believe to be right.

    Concerning morality, what other than your opinion and the opinion of others is information?

  7. #32
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    And what does that have with utilitarianism? Look, morality has to be based on something, right? In most cases this is a set of absolute majority agreed baseline values, which means that morality is based on utilitarianism already: it's what the majority believe to be right.

    Concerning morality, what other than your opinion and the opinion of others is information?
    No it's not. Utilitarianism is a rather recent concept in comparison to the deliberations of the human heart. You may base your morality off of utilitarianism, but they're still mutually exclusive. The number of people who believe something does not make it more correct, subjectivity and objectivity are not determined by the number of believers. I thought you said you agreed there was no such thing as objective morality?

    That is it, but considering opinion in morality is not composed entirely of empirical evidence it's easy to see why it's a mistake to give it exclusive say.

  8. #33
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    Subjectivity is influenced by everything you experience. It is an opinion. Morality is subjective. It is your personal opinion of an act. It is influenced by experience and your thoughts and feelings. If I decide to base morality on the opinion of the majority then that's my subjective opinion. However, that does not mean that a certain action is wrong or right, only that I think it's wrong or right. My opinion on the morality of an action is no less or more valid than yours or anyone else's.

    I don't base morality on empiricism.

  9. #34
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    Yeah you're right. But how exactly does more people believing in something make it more valid? It doesn't change anything with the underlying theory. Simply being subjective doesn't render it worthless as all things have a level of subjectivity intrinsic to their existence.

  10. #35
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    It doesn't. I'm not claiming it does. No moral system is more valid than any other.

  11. #36
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    That's not true either. Although ultimately it may simply be an opinion, not all opinions are complete in thought. Many morality systems don't sync up with reality, whereas many do. Subjectivity is not equality.

  12. #37
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    In what way do some moral systems not match with reality?

  13. #38
    So...noisy Stein's Avatar
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    I shouldn't even have to explain that.

  14. #39
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    You do.

  15. #40
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    Alright then. Say theres a man with a face made of cotton. He believes everyone whose face isn't made of cotton is an inhuman monster. It's just as subjective as any other system of morality, but is it really just as valid as any other? I'd like to hear your arguement that it is.

  16. #41
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    "Inhuman monster" is a statement of morality? As in he believes everybody who doesn't have a face made of cotton is automatically wrong in any and all actions they undertake? Well, I think the most important question is why anyone would base the morality of an action on the person doing it rather than the action itself, especially when it would lead to contradictions with one's own actions. However, I have no reason to think his system is any less valid than any other (other than it not agreeing with the majority on whatever geographical scale I feel like at the time). It's just different. No moral system describes reality. It just influences our decisions.

  17. #42
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    Sure it is, it's a testament of his feelings about the people who violate his moral code. And no action in and of itself is immoral. The context of the action is what determines right and wrong in regards to morality. It is a faulty moral code because it determines the quality of a persons character based on something they have no responsibility for.

  18. #43
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    Moral codes are about actions, not objects.

  19. #44
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    Moral codes are about whatever is deemed important by the individual making it.

  20. #45
    Vanity of vanities, all is vanity Hicky's Avatar
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    Tory Administration has just said it will slash the quasi-autonomous non-governmental organization that regulates banks and bestow said power to the Bank of England.

  21. #46
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    im not familiar with the intricacies of british finance policy. what is your commentary on the issue hicky.

  22. #47
    Vanity of vanities, all is vanity Hicky's Avatar
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    My commentary? David Cameron makes no real justification of doing this, he just used a lot of empty adjectives to describe the situation with FSA, and somehow progressed to saying that the Bank of England regulating banks would be good thing for economic recovery. It's kinda just to get fatcats that aren't already on his side to vote for him - pretty much everything he does is to raise his chance of getting elected. Although, he would create a council for financial stability which could either just be more GOAT bullshit (Government of All Talents, Gordon Brown said, "I will put national interest before sectional interest, and form a government of all talents") or could genuinely help the recession, which would be good I suppose.

    In other news, the Afghan War (probably you can contribute to this) debate is so fucking boring. We need to increase spending and spend it on the right things, not put more fucking chinooks on the battlefield. Is that really the solution? The debate in the House of Commons has just been helicopters and it's boring as fuck. The Afghan War debate is generally boring as fuck and the public are incredibly misinformed on the subject (my dad says troops aren't given the right equipment - they've been better equipped than any time in 40 years, according to Gordon Brown).

  23. #48
    Nidogod That Ho!!! Nidogod's Avatar
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    Look all I know is if The Ministry Of Magic got their shit together, they wouldn't be picked off by Helena Bonham Carter & Sabretooth, am I right?


    I live. I love. I kill. I catch Pokemons. I am content.

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