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Thread: Evolution.

  1. #1
    A low to mid functioning sociopath. Shadow's Avatar
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    Default Evolution.

    Despite tim and the near death state of this forum, I'm still going to attempt to entertain this discussion.

    So, anyone have some solid reasons as to why this theory is true?
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  2. #2
    In Soviet Russia, Editor is protected from YOU!! The Editor's Avatar
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    The overwhelming evidence.

  3. #3
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    Look at bacteria for one day straight in fast motion and you can literally see them evolve.

    Fossils

    You can test it out easily by killing the goldfish you do not like the traits with in a few genrations you hae whatever fucked up goldfish you want.

    Dog breeding

  4. #4
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    yeah, dog breeding. plus agriculture. plus viruses and medicine. for the most noticeable things.

    then of course you have the fact that the fossil record will always have more complex organisms above less complex organisms.

    human chromosome II. atavisms. the discovery of intermediary fossils.

    some easy links
    http://evolution.berkeley.edu/evolib...hp?topic_id=46
    http://www.newscientist.com/article/...nceptions.html

    the better question would be, is there any kind of "evidence" that whatsoever contradicts evolution?


    ps if anyone tries to say something like "well evolution is just a theory" they are the biggest idiot in the entire world

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    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    also: im not sure if you've noticed this, but there are both black and white people in the world. also hispanic. and asian. and middle eastern and indigenous americans.

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    http://www.youtube.com/watch?gl=GB&h...x=0&playnext=1

    There's a fair bit about evolution in this series of videos.

  8. #8
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    although it still is a theory until we invent a time machine which is the only way to 100% proove it

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    Watch the link, Kirbx.

  10. #10
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    I believe in evolution but still think it shoudl remain as a really good theory becuase it does have some small flaws.

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    Nothing is ever proven in science. The more evidence for something the more confident we are in the theory, and even if it has some small flaws in specific circumstances we can still have confidence in the general theory.

  12. #12
    Defenestration is imminent pichubro's Avatar
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    The only thing more annoying that explaining evolution is explaining evolution to a die-hard, 12 year old Christian who believes that evolution doesn't happen because we aren't growing new organs. I guess she thinks evolution = new organs = evolution. I couldn't get through her thick skull that growing organs is only (SOMETIMES) a product of evolution, and definitely not a factor. If something doesn't need new organs, it won't grow them. Which she then said I had just confirmed her that evolution has stopped, if it started at all.
    I sighed a lot during our "discussion." :|

    Evolution is so easy to prove; I can't see why people try to disprove it (besides the religion factor).

  13. #13
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    you know like all of the popes within the last 50 years have siad evolution is a great idea

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    You should explain to her that evolution makes small changes over time, not big ones. Nothing evolves a new organ within our lifetime.

  15. #15
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    well as already said simple oraganisms can...

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    *wink* leo33wii's Avatar
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    Silly little girl, that's why men have larger brains and women have brains equal to size of squirrels...

    Joking... but seriously.

    Evolution is improving the organism so that it is better adapted for it's environment. That could mean growing a new organ or appendage to something as a female species having less chances of a miscarriage.

    Since the past 2,000 years humans have been constantly evolving. Here's another sign of evolution in humans that have happened within the last 50 years. All new women are growing an inch taller for every new generation while men are growing a half inch less for each new generation. (This is an average. Overall women are growing taller while men are getting shorter.)
    The reason for that is because of human selection that we do on ourselves. The pretty people and fashion. Most Americans want to see their women appear like super models, where they are tall and thin. Men who are short and muscular appear intimidating. (I guess tall men aren't as scary :-\)
    -----------------------

    Now, let's look at the dog. Did you know there is only 1 (one) species of dog.
    But there are thousands of dog breeds. Key word breeds!! If you take a look at humans you can say pretty much the same thing. There is only one species of humans and their many races (or breeds).
    Any human can have a child with another human (as long as they are the opposite sex).
    The same thing with dogs. You can cross breed any dog, but it would be pretty hard to get a Greyhound to screw a chihuahua. You have to do artificial insemination, but they will produce puppies.

    What we find attractive is what I call.... natural selection. All animals do this and humans do it as well.
    Read up on the latest Discover Magazine to find out more on human evolution. Also read National Geographic (the Darwin issue). It explains that all genetic information is the same for all species on earth (at least there is a root kit). You can take a flies DNA and change it (turning some genes on or off) and you could "program" it and get a rabbit, a hoarse, a frog, or even a baby human by adding or removing other genetic information.
    There are genes that cross species. Human lips are formed by a single gene, which is also found in birds (in birds it forms their beak), and the same gene is found in some fish (where this gene forms the fishes lips as well).

    I also want to say that we found the missing link this year. It connects us to chimpanzee's and other primates.
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    Kirbx, simple organisms don't really have organs in the traditional sense. That's why they're simple.

  18. #18
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    Bacteria don't even have organelles, they just sort of blob around.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

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    Indeed. They aren't complex enough to require specialised regions for chemical reactions.

  20. #20
    *wink* leo33wii's Avatar
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    We need someone to play the devil's advocate for this thread to be interesting, don't you agree?
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  21. #21
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    So we can tear them apart? Yes, yes we do.

  22. #22
    Nidogod That Ho!!! Nidogod's Avatar
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    Ok, I'll do it.

    Can your "Devil-ution" explain the beauty of a baby's smile or the twinkle in its eyes? That's no ape twinkle! That's something endowed with the grace of God! The case for Intelligent Design is obvious! If you see a stack of coins, you know that somebody stacked stacked them. They didn't just "happen" to randomly appear that way.

    Also Charles Darwin was a racist and Adolph Hitler believed in Evolution.

    On an unrelated note, pay no attention to the following...

    Birth of New Species Witnessed by Scientists
    By Brandon Keim November 16, 2009

    On one of the Galapagos islands whose finches shaped the theories of a young Charles Darwin, biologists have witnessed that elusive moment when a single species splits in two.

    In many ways, the split followed predictable patterns, requiring a hybrid newcomer who’d already taken baby steps down a new evolutionary path. But playing an unexpected part was chance, and the newcomer singing his own special song.

    This miniature evolutionary saga is described in a paper published Monday in the Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences. It’s authored by Peter and Rosemary Grant, a husband-and-wife team who have spent much of the last 36 years studying a group of bird species known collectively as Darwin’s finches.

    The finches — or, technically, tanagers — have adapted to the conditions of each island in the Galapagos, and they provided Darwin with a clear snapshot of evolutionary divergence when he sailed there on the HMS Beagle. The Grants have pushed that work further, with decades of painstaking observations providing a real-time record of evolution in action. In the PNAS paper, they describe something Darwin could only have dreamed of watching: the birth of a new species.

    The species’ forefather was a medium ground finch, or Geospiza fortis, who flew from a neighboring island to the Grants’ island of Daphne Major, and into their nets, in 1981. He “was unusually large, especially in beak width, sang an unusual song” and had a few gene variants that could be traced to another finch species, they wrote. This exotic stranger soon found a mate, who also happened to have a few hybrid genes. The happy couple had five sons.

    In the tradition of finches, for whom songs are passed from father to son and used to serenade potential mates, the sons learned their immigrant father’s tunes. But their father’s vocalizations were strange: he’d tried to mimick the natives, but accidentally introduced new notes and inflections, like a person who learns a song in a language he doesn’t understand.

    These tunes set the sons apart, as did their unusual size. Though they found mates, it may only have taken a couple generations for the new lineage to ignore — or be ignored by — local finches, and breed only with each other. The Grants couldn’t tell for certain when this started, but they were certain after four generations, when a drought struck the island, killing all but a single brother and sister. They mated with each other, and their children did the same.

    No exact rule exists for deciding when a group of animals constitutes a separate species. That question “is rarely if ever asked,” as speciation isn’t something that scientists have been fortunate enough to watch at the precise moment of divergence, except in bacteria and other simple creatures. But after at least three generations of reproductive isolation, the Grants felt comfortable in designating the new lineage as an incipient species.

    The future of the species is far from certain. It’s possible that they’ll be out-competed by other finches on the island. Their initial gene pool may contain flaws that will be magnified with time. A chance disaster could wipe them out. The birds might even return to the fold of their parent species, and merge with them through interbreeding.

    But whatever happens, their legacy will remain: New species can emerge very quickly — and sometimes all it takes is a song.



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  23. #23
    Nidogod That Ho!!! Nidogod's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by leo33wii View Post
    Since the past 2,000 years humans have been constantly evolving. Here's another sign of evolution in humans that have happened within the last 50 years. All new women are growing an inch taller for every new generation while men are growing a half inch less for each new generation. (This is an average. Overall women are growing taller while men are getting shorter.)
    The reason for that is because of human selection that we do on ourselves. The pretty people and fashion. Most Americans want to see their women appear like super models, where they are tall and thin. Men who are short and muscular appear intimidating. (I guess tall men aren't as scary :-\)
    -----------------------

    Now, let's look at the dog. Did you know there is only 1 (one) species of dog.
    But there are thousands of dog breeds. Key word breeds!! If you take a look at humans you can say pretty much the same thing. There is only one species of humans and their many races (or breeds).
    Any human can have a child with another human (as long as they are the opposite sex).
    The same thing with dogs. You can cross breed any dog, but it would be pretty hard to get a Greyhound to screw a chihuahua. You have to do artificial insemination, but they will produce puppies.

    What we find attractive is what I call.... natural selection. All animals do this and humans do it as well.
    Interesting thing about the dogs is that if you cross breed a Chihuahua with a St. Bernard, the offsPring will not survive because the DNA of their parents is too radically different. Even crazier is that if the Chihuahua is the mother, she'd likely die mid pregnancy from carrying those giant, mutant fetuses.

    As for attractiveness, I recently stumbled across this article explaining why most people look like average shmucks and not supermodels...

    It's a classic tale of how mediocrity is maintained. Evolutionary biologists in California have discovered that when males shower attractive females with attention, it actually undermines those females' fitness as mothers. That means fit females don't pass their genes on.

    Today PLoS Biology published a study of fruitflies, a species where the male flies show a marked preference for mating with larger females because they are more fecund. The problem is that the males show such aggressive preferences that they basically badger the females constantly to mate. What this means is that the females are so harried that they have less time to search for food, which degrades their health. Also, among fruitflies, the mating process is itself damaging to the health of the females - fruitfly sperm is toxic.

    As a result, the most-desired females become far less capable of generating healthy offspring. And the smaller, less fit females wind up bearing as many offspring as the fitter ones. In the end, the males' aggressive mating with the fittest females ends up preventing their species from evolving into a much fitter group.

    Tristan A. F. Long, one of the authors of the study, said:

    These larger females are disproportionately harassed and harmed, by males attempting to obtain matings. When these males are ‘choosy' with their courtship, there may be negative consequences to the species' ability to adaptively evolve.

    What's interesting about this study is that it's one of the few to point out how male mate choice affects evolution of a species. Usually female mate choice is emphasized, except in species where females are dominant. Here we can see clearly that male mate choice is having a profound and not very salutary affect on the future of fruitfly fitness. The issue here is obviously not attractiveness, but instead the kind of fitness associated with being larger and more fecund. If larger, "attractive" females are harrassed into reproductive uselessness by the males, then any traits they possess that make them healthier (a trait for metabolic efficiency, for instance) won't be able to spread through the population as quickly as it might if males chose mates randomly.


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  24. #24
    The One and Only trixie's Avatar
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    Hmmm....... very enlightening.
    Originally made by LM:


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  25. #25
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    You mean the alleles are too different.

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