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Thread: the Greek economy

  1. #26
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    and yeah low regulation and making it simple to do business can work really well if you have strong labor standards and generous social welfare programs imposed by the government. but not without them.

  2. #27
    is good for you
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    and yeah low regulation and making it simple to do business can work really well if you have strong labor standards and generous social welfare programs imposed by the government. but not without them.
    You're such a CASUAL

  3. #28
    if i had a horse for every time i heard that, i'd have 2 horse Pants's Avatar
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    sometimes i wish i wasn't moving to pittsburgh in 2014. its gonna be quite fun with the NG offices and CGR though, so i'll manage.


    your welcome

  4. #29
    This pic is definitely of me!! Solly's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    i dont get how people try to say that social welfare programs work better in european countries because the "societies are different." it really doesnt make any sense. you can say their being smaller plays a role because the programs are more manageable. also i love how its usually PATRIOTIC CONSERVATIVES(rc not included here, just a generalization) who say this. "social welfare works better in europe because their societies are just a lot better than ours. also america is the best."
    Social welfare programs would actually probably work better in the americas due to the abundance of resources available, as opposed to the overpopulated shepherd lands of Greece.

  5. #30
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    The society does really have a lot to do with just what the people are willing to sacrifice. You can't enforce social equality on a muslim nation that persecutes other religions and women for fun, you can't force Swedes and Norwegians to accept a free market with all it's personal responsibility and hardships, and you can't expect Americans to sacrifice half their paychecks for welfare programs a lot of them will only minimally benefit from.

    Now granted a lot of Americans are stupid and don't realize a properly constructed social healthcare system is actually beneficial *to everyone* from the poorest bloke to the richest motherfucker or that increased public transportation options such as rail lines and busses would lift a tremendous burden off our infrastructure. Switzerland's population, aside from being rich, also seem to have their heads on their shoulders.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  6. #31
    Registered Users Regular Rayne's Avatar
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    PokeDream forums, circa 1850

    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah
    You can't expect Americans to accept outlawing slavery when so many of them make their income from the slave trade.

  7. #32
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    So Rayne, how's that Ottoman Empire doing?
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  8. #33
    grecophile walrusss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Solly View Post
    Social welfare programs would actually probably work better in the americas due to the abundance of resources available, as opposed to the overpopulated shepherd lands of Greece.
    overpopulated? hardly. the country only has 10 million people.

    greece doesn't necessarily lack resources. in terms of natural resources, Greece is actually quite rich in them and could make a good profit off of them. but they're not tapped into for a variety of political and social reasons, like bad relations with Turkey. Social welfare programs fail for cultural reasons there.

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  9. #34
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    'social welfare programs fail for cultural reasons there'

    guys stop making statements that dont mean anything

  10. #35
    Man Of All Things Merry buckweat's Avatar
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    RC might just be my favorite PD member, sorry Justin
    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    get out of my way kirby, i've got gulags to build.

  11. #36
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah View Post
    The society does really have a lot to do with just what the people are willing to sacrifice. You can't enforce social equality on a muslim nation that persecutes other religions and women for fun, you can't force Swedes and Norwegians to accept a free market with all it's personal responsibility and hardships, and you can't expect Americans to sacrifice half their paychecks for welfare programs a lot of them will only minimally benefit from.

    Now granted a lot of Americans are stupid and don't realize a properly constructed social healthcare system is actually beneficial *to everyone* from the poorest bloke to the richest motherfucker or that increased public transportation options such as rail lines and busses would lift a tremendous burden off our infrastructure. Switzerland's population, aside from being rich, also seem to have their heads on their shoulders.
    *actively brainwash people for 100+ years about something*
    "well we cant expect americans to not believe something we have actively brainwashed them into believing for 100 years"

  12. #37
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    buckweat stop being vaguely conservative by denying all your conservative beliefs when questioned of them directly and then immediately profess admiration for said conservative beliefs whenever they are enunciated by someone else

  13. #38
    Man Of All Things Merry buckweat's Avatar
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    fuck it tomorrow when I wake up I'll make a thread with the few FIRM beliefs that I have because most of my views actually don't line up with hardline conservatism at all
    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    get out of my way kirby, i've got gulags to build.

  14. #39
    is good for you
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    We all know PD member's track record of keeping promises about possible GROUNDBREAKING posts, let you not be an example, Buckweat

  15. #40
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    Maybe it's the blue color of the forum that just makes people lazy, hmm

  16. #41
    Man Of All Things Merry buckweat's Avatar
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    tbh it'll probably be tomorrow after school but fuck you guys it'll be tomorrow damn it
    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    get out of my way kirby, i've got gulags to build.

  17. #42
    Defenestration is imminent pichubro's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Celery View Post
    Maybe it's the blue color of the forum that just makes people lazy, hmm
    It's relaxing to look at indeed

  18. #43
    grecophile walrusss's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    'social welfare programs fail for cultural reasons there'

    guys stop making statements that dont mean anything
    it does mean something.

    as I already mentioned in a previous post, the greeks have a huge problem with supporting the social welfare system. they evade taxes like it's their job, retire freakishly early and demand incredibly generous pensions, barely work as it is, and have just about strangled the private sector to death. those problems are all due to the lax, we'll-do-it-later Mediterranean culture. if greece's inability to implement a working social welfare system aren't due to culture, god, then why have they failed so miserably so far?

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  19. #44
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    hm greeks seem to work quite a bit http://twentycentparadigms.blogspot....ork-ethic.html

    the greeks are in shit because they rely so much on tourism and shipping and both of those things have had a hard time over the last half decade. the framing of greece's troubles as falling squarely on public sector pay and entitlements are just part of the ongoing pro-austerity narrative. not that greece's government is so great or anything, it's rather corrupt but that has a lot to do with its recent crazy political history.

    but anyway that's not really what we were talking about in terms of social welfare not working for "cultural reasons" so shut up walrus i'll fight you!!!

  20. #45
    grecophile walrusss's Avatar
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    pension and a bloated public sector aren't all of their woes, but it's a huge part. other countries rely on tourism just as much, but they aren't in as deep shit as greece

    and bring it on, god, I can totally beat you up

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  21. #46
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    i'd imagine greece is the only high income country which relies so strongly on tourism, i think its close to 20% of their gdp

  22. #47
    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    God, don't pick a fight with a sociologist unless you're willing to beat them down with hard science. They're in a line of study where making shit up and attaching a percentage to it qualifies for grant money.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

  23. #48
    grecophile walrusss's Avatar
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    haha, so I'm lumped in with sociologists now?

    well, whatever. I'll concede Greece would be in much less trouble did it not rely so much on tourism, and that there is corruption at all levels of the government there. There are all sorts of economic factors at play, some of which are the Greeks' fault and some of which are not. My point is merely that Greek culture had a good deal to do with making things worse.

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  24. #49
    princeso Kirby's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    hm greeks seem to work quite a bit http://twentycentparadigms.blogspot....ork-ethic.html

    the greeks are in shit because they rely so much on tourism and shipping and both of those things have had a hard time over the last half decade. the framing of greece's troubles as falling squarely on public sector pay and entitlements are just part of the ongoing pro-austerity narrative. not that greece's government is so great or anything, it's rather corrupt but that has a lot to do with its recent crazy political history.

    but anyway that's not really what we were talking about in terms of social welfare not working for "cultural reasons" so shut up walrus i'll fight you!!!
    Ireland?

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