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Thread: Cloning

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    Default Cloning

    Ok, so tonight on the news they had this story about the first human clones. This left me thinking about wether or not a clone would be the same person as the original (mentaly, not physically). I doubt it could ever be answered, so instead I'd like to hear your views on the ethics of cloning and stem cell research.

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    Make your move Muttsy's Avatar
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    Actually, I think they would almost certainly not be the same in personality. Even simpler organisms like cats have been cloned, only they have been shy or scared where the original cat's were friendly and active or vise versa. A person's personality is determined as much by their environment as their genes. As for moral view of stem cell research and cloning, it's a tough sell. I mean you can claim human benefit with stem cell, but what do you possibly gain by cloning? It just seems cruel to me, imagine finding out you're just a cloned science experiment, it would be a hard realization. And cloning cows for food? Is that even safe? We messed with plant genes to make them resistant to pesticides for crops and now we have "super" weeds. I just think it could back fire on us, but then again we've all seen like twenty "Matrix" movies each I'm sure, maybe we're all biased.

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    Furry Authority RedCheetah's Avatar
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    We can allow lesbian couples to take sperm donors, male couples to take foster children, but god forbid we let people adopt kids born from test tubes. =>_>= I don't have issues with cloning, there's a lot to be learned, however I'm afraid if they start doing inhumane experiments on clones we may find ourselves further lowering the sanctity of life.
    "A human being should be able to change a diaper, plan an invasion, butcher a hog, conn a ship, design a building, write a sonnet, balance accounts, build a wall, set a bone, comfort the dying, take orders, give orders, cooperate, act alone, solve equations, analyze a new problem, pitch manure, program a computer, cook a tasty meal, fight efficiently, die gallantly. Specialization is for insects." - Time Enough For Love, by Robert Heinlein

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    As for personality, That can't be answered because the past can't be recreated. I you cloned yourself it'd be near impossible for you to recreate the conditions you grew up under.

    Cloned hamburgers are safe.

    Depending on my future, I have actually thought about cloning myself to create an ilussion of immortality.

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    Quote Originally Posted by RedCheetah View Post
    We can allow lesbian couples to take sperm donors, male couples to take foster children, but god forbid we let people adopt kids born from test tubes. =>_>= I don't have issues with cloning, there's a lot to be learned, however I'm afraid if they start doing inhumane experiments on clones we may find ourselves further lowering the sanctity of life.
    That's my only problem with it. If we start cloning people, where do we draw the line? I would feel sorry for those who would find out that they had no parents, that they were a genetic experiment.

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    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    There will be no human cloning in Tim McDonald's America.

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    The potential for discrimination will be too enormous. First of all, originally massive discrimination against clones, then when genetic manipulation of unborn children becomes popular, it will cost an enormous amount, and since genetically manipulated children will obviously be much healthier, physically fit, and intelligent than others, the class divide between those who can and can't afford it will be more massive than probably any other class divide in human history.

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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    There will be no human cloning in Tim McDonald's America.
    Yes, but this isn't your country yet.

    The potential for discrimination will be too enormous. First of all, originally massive discrimination against clones, then when genetic manipulation of unborn children becomes popular, it will cost an enormous amount,
    Right now they don't allow clone embryos to get more than five to ten days old, but who's to say that if and when they start cloning people it won't be available because of price?

    and since genetically manipulated children will obviously be much healthier, physically fit, and intelligent than others,
    There's a difference between genetic manipulation and cloning. A clone is an exact copy of someone's dna, and therefore the clone will have the same traits as the original. If I had inheirited a a trait that caused me to have blue eyes, my clone would have blue eyes also.

    the class divide between those who can and can't afford it will be more massive than probably any other class divide in human history.
    Like the divide between black slaves and their white masters? As I said, a clone is an exact copy of the original. And besides, it's been proven that things like strength, injuries, and itelligence that can't be inheirited.

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    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    That's okay you have no idea what was said in my posts.

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    What's that supposed to mean?

    Also, when do I get off restriction?

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    The whole issue of cloning would be an uproar. The world would be split in half over the idea and I just don't think it's necessary to turn the earth into a sci-fi movie.

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    But this isn't sci-fi. It really can and has been done. And besides, people will argue about anything and everything.

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    Magnetical dark hole the master's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Omnipotent Chaos View Post
    But this isn't sci-fi. It really can and has been done. And besides, people will argue about anything and everything.
    I heard that sheeps were cloned, but humans.

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    It was on nbc last night. They cloned humans, but the embryos were destroyed within ten days of being made because of the questionability of it's ethics.

    Edit: You know, cloning can be really useful for certain things, like rebuilding the populations of indangered species.

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    If it is, I haven't heard of that religion. I don't know how it could be agaisnt religion anyway's. Cloning wasn't discovered/thought of/whatever until sometime in the 80's.

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    Magnetical dark hole the master's Avatar
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    If I remember right it is against a few religions. If those people find out that could make anouther war, and earth is way to weak for another war.

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    The meaning of life is "bucket". Omnipotent Chaos's Avatar
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    But war is the way of the humans, the day there is world wide peace is the day before the world ends. Humans have been at war over various bullshit for the last 5000-6000 years, a war over the ethics of cloning won't make a difference.

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    Magnetical dark hole the master's Avatar
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    We won't be able to make war in 50 years anyway. We won't have enough oil for out cars.

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    Ever hear of aternate energy sources? Scientists are already making solar power, hydrogen power, and electric energy more useable. How do you know that in fifty years we won't have new and more powerful energy sources available.

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    Quote Originally Posted by the master View Post
    Isn't cloning against religion anyway?
    Are you fucking stupid?

    Quote Originally Posted by the master View Post
    We won't be able to make war in 50 years anyway. We won't have enough oil for out cars.
    We can make war in 50 years if we want to. If we run out of oil there will be a back up plan by then.

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    Magnetical dark hole the master's Avatar
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    Solar energy: Yeah, that works, but what about winter? And the sun ain't strong enough for good energy.
    Hydrogen power: That also could work, but it also takes long to make, and it's not enough for cars.
    Electric energy: I have nothing to say to this.
    And cars NEED oil to have enough energy to drive. Just electrizity is not enough.
    Plant oil also works, but it's hard to make.

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    Magnetical dark hole the master's Avatar
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    Ok, I take that religion crap back..

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    Quote Originally Posted by the master View Post
    Solar energy: Yeah, that works, but what about winter? And the sun ain't strong enough for good energy.
    The sun's rays are fine in the winter. The fact that the snow is reflective is far from hindering if you want solar energy.

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    As I said, they're making these options more readily avalible and more efficient. Besides, They're discovering more energy sources.

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    Advanced Trainer Nocturne's Avatar
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    The whole idea about cloning yourself to have an illusion of immortality is bullshit. Your DNA is encoded with age naturally, and until we completely unravel every bit of the genome, we could do nothing to change it, and even if we do, there's no guarantee.

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