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Thread: Philosophy

  1. #101
    Pokemon Champion Mario The Black Knight's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    To be honest, if you're working 50+ hours a week and not getting enough money to live on then what the fuck are you doing in that job in the first place. You are obviously either living beyond reasonable levels for your income or are being paid below minimum wage. And have you not heard of student loans? They exist so that you can go to university. I'm getting a student loan. Maintenance loan too. And then I pay all that money back when I have a job.
    OH MY FUCKING GOD!

    Do you know what student aid comes from!? It's pretty much welfare money taken from the same place all the other federal welfare programs get their funding!

    Your an idiot The Editor. And if you want to site a fucking source, refer to the post I quoted, that should be pleanty proof enough.

  2. #102
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    Student loans do indeed come from the government. However, unlike welfare, that money comes back. All of it. That's why they are loans rather than grants.

  3. #103
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    From time immemorable people have banned together to take care of the sick, wounded and incapable of the tribe. Even dolphins do this.

    To say that the "I shouldn't have to help anyone I don't want to, and I don't want to therefore I shouldn't have to help anyone period." argument is unbelievably selfish, inhumane and basically greedy is an understatement.

    I agree that the state shouldn't support people indefinitely, but there are times when people need assistance and it is the responsibility of society to provide that.

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  4. #104
    cogito ergo doleo Keke Le Cat's Avatar
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    Um, there are usually more people than there are jobs. A family cannot live on minimum wage, it is more than 185% below poverty level and said family usually qualifies for government aide.

    The people who work those jobs either cannot find a better or are unskilled workers.

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  5. #105
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    Student loans do indeed come from the government. However, unlike welfare, that money comes back. All of it. That's why they are loans rather than grants.
    Student aid comes in the form of both Grants and loans. Whatever you don't qualify for in grants you get in loans. And reguardless that money comes from the same source. So obviously it has a legitimate use, so what do you have to complain about now?

  6. #106
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    Do people on here read posts before posting? The elderly and the disabled (mentally and physically) do deserve the money. However, people who live beyond their means and show incredible lack of foresight do not. The consequences of your actions should be yours to bare. If someone wants to give money to help you, then that's fine. But forcing people to give money is not, and that is the point I'm making.

    Yes they have, but because they wanted to, not because they were made to.

    Of course you shouldn't have to help people. But just because you shouldn't doesn't mean you can't or won't.

    Well then, why doesn't the government loan them money at 0% interest? That way the money comes back. That's a much better system. The government loans you money so you can tide yourself over until you sort things out, and then you pay it back gradually. With no interest on it you don't lose anything, and the government doesn't lose anything either. Clearly this is superior to a "throw money at it" solution.

  7. #107
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    What kind of idiot starts a family if he doesn't have the means to provide for it?

    Tough luck. That's what you get for not learning enough.

    I have nothing against student loans. I think they are brilliant idea. However, I have a fair bit against grants, because there the money escapes from the government.

  8. #108
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    Do people on here read posts before posting? The elderly and the disabled (mentally and physically) do deserve the money. However, people who live beyond their means and show incredible lack of foresight do not. The consequences of your actions should be yours to bare. If someone wants to give money to help you, then that's fine. But forcing people to give money is not, and that is the point I'm making.

    Yes they have, but because they wanted to, not because they were made to.

    Of course you shouldn't have to help people. But just because you shouldn't doesn't mean you can't or won't.
    Well then, why doesn't the government loan them money at 0% interest? That way the money comes back. That's a much better system. The government loans you money so you can tide yourself over until you sort things out, and then you pay it back gradually. With no interest on it you don't lose anything, and the government doesn't lose anything either. Clearly this is superior to a "throw money at it" solution.
    We read your posts, the question is, do you? Do you beileve the shit your saying here?

    Some people don't own cars, they just walk from place to place, are they being forced to pay for transportation? How about people who don't get sick too often, are they getting forced to pay for hospitals? The rights of society as a whole are more important than the rights of a single man. Some people need roads, some people need hospitals, and some need money to live. By being made to pay taxes your helping society as a whole. And besides, the general idea of welfare is to get them back into a financial condition that they can pay taxes again, which is kinda like paying them back.

  9. #109
    cogito ergo doleo Keke Le Cat's Avatar
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    There is some huge figure out there, something like 80% of all children in the US are in single parent homes, and 60% of those were unwed mothers or somesuch.

    Lots of people make families without providing for them. My husband works with a guy who has 6 kids and pays child support to 3 mothers, each mother gets like 65$ biweekly... Do you think that any child can live on 130$ per month? Or even just eat on that not including clothes, toys, etc?

    So some guy marries a woman, has an affair and leaves her with 3 kids. She works 60 hours a week but day care takes over half her wages. Child support is ridiculous. How can she feed her kids? Is it her fault her husband left?

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  10. #110
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    I think I can safely claim victory here and leave this. I'd continue this verbal battle, but clearly your unarmed. And attacking an unarmed man isn't ethical to any code of honor, especially in a battle like this.

  11. #111
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    Ed, my respect for you is waning.

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  12. #112
    what about .. eyebrows God's Avatar
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    You had respect for him?

  13. #113
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    What kind of idiot starts a family if he doesn't have the means to provide for it?
    THE KIND THAT WAS TAUGHT TO DO SO BY HIS SOCIAL DISCOURSE AND CULTURE YOU FUCKING IDIOT

    The Editor you are a very immature person.

  14. #114
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    You had respect for him?
    Yeah, really

  15. #115
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    ITT The Editor being a faggot
    I won't take the time to respond because Tim and Mario have it covered. If you make one fucking comment Solly...
    -.---.----..

  16. #116
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    Quote Originally Posted by God View Post
    THE KIND THAT WAS TAUGHT TO DO SO BY HIS SOCIAL DISCOURSE AND CULTURE YOU FUCKING IDIOT
    And, of course, it is beyond this person to think "Hmm, I obviously don't make enough money to look after any kids. Maybe I shouldn't start a family." His stupidity, his problem.

  17. #117
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mario The Black Knight View Post
    Some people don't own cars, they just walk from place to place, are they being forced to pay for transportation? How about people who don't get sick too often, are they getting forced to pay for hospitals? The rights of society as a whole are more important than the rights of a single man. Some people need roads, some people need hospitals, and some need money to live. By being made to pay taxes your helping society as a whole. And besides, the general idea of welfare is to get them back into a financial condition that they can pay taxes again, which is kinda like paying them back.
    Transportation goes beyond roads. Buses, the Underground and trains get covered by it too. Nobody walks absolutely everywhere: sometimes they'll take the bus, others the tube, and occasionally the train when going from town to town.

    With hospitals the money goes into a service that you or someone you care about is extremely likely to use, and effectively acts as a safety net: if you get ill there will be somewhere for you to go.

    In welfare the money goes to one person. It doesn't spread out to the rest of us. This money is not recovered by the government in tax, as the tax would normally be additional funds rather than balancing a debt. It is lost to the economy, where it simply makes the rounds. A large percentage will come back due to income tax, but some will have still gotten away.

  18. #118
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keke Le Cat View Post
    There is some huge figure out there, something like 80% of all children in the US are in single parent homes, and 60% of those were unwed mothers or somesuch.

    Lots of people make families without providing for them. My husband works with a guy who has 6 kids and pays child support to 3 mothers, each mother gets like 65$ biweekly... Do you think that any child can live on 130$ per month? Or even just eat on that not including clothes, toys, etc?

    So some guy marries a woman, has an affair and leaves her with 3 kids. She works 60 hours a week but day care takes over half her wages. Child support is ridiculous. How can she feed her kids? Is it her fault her husband left?
    The children shoud go into care. End of.

  19. #119
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    Quote Originally Posted by Keke Le Cat View Post
    Ed, my respect for you is waning.
    Remind me to care.

  20. #120
    Pokemon Champion Mario The Black Knight's Avatar
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    You've been beat The Editor. Go play your Xbox and be ignorant.

  21. #121
    cogito ergo doleo Keke Le Cat's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by The Editor View Post
    And, of course, it is beyond this person to think "Hmm, I obviously don't make enough money to look after any kids. Maybe I shouldn't start a family." His stupidity, his problem.
    That doesn't answer my question.

    So some guy marries a woman, has an affair and leaves her with 3 kids. She works 60 hours a week but day care takes over half her wages. Child support is ridiculous. How can she feed her kids? Is it her fault her husband left?
    How was the wife to know he'd leave her and have 3 more kids? How is that the kids fault? How is it her fault? She should have had a crystal ball and looked into the future to figure her man was a tyrant? Unfortunately life doesn't work that way.

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  22. #122
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    I'm not beaten just because you say so, Mario.

    I answered that question in post 118.

  23. #123
    Pokemon Champion Mario The Black Knight's Avatar
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    No, your beaten by pure fact. You don't know shit about the topic. You don't qualify to battle in this weight class. it's Ali and Tyson vs Hopkins And the formers are wearing brass knucks. You just can't win

  24. #124
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    You can't win either. I know I can't convince you I'm right, and you know you can't convince me I'm wrong.

  25. #125
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    But the end result is that you lose. I might not win completely, but you still lost horribly.

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